freezing key in ice

bdbgum · Post by **bdbgum** » 29 Nov 2007, 22:03

couple of questions;

- how can I make the water freeze faster?
- what are some cheap containers I can use if I'm out of an ice cube 'tray'?
- will the key not deform while in the ice?

Grinser · Post by **Grinser** » 29 Nov 2007, 22:09

I rather doubt a metal key would be deformed. The tiny amount of deformation that eventually happens should fall well into the tolerances of a lock. Otherwise no lock would be functional during a hard winter.
Chemistry is not my thing, so the only thing that I can advice to speed up the freezing is actually turning up the fridge.
For cheap containers, how about plastic bottles or a milk carton... if its too big just cut it into the desired size. Even a glass container would work as long as the ice can expand enough in one direction so it won`t crack the container.

bdbgum · Post by **bdbgum** » 30 Nov 2007, 18:00

Thanks. I guess I should try it myself sometime.

Slave 1 · Post by **Slave 1** » 30 Nov 2007, 22:35

hot water will freeze quicker than cold water, really it does.

Grinser · Post by **Grinser** » 30 Nov 2007, 23:06

So it would take less time to cool water from lets say 50° Celsius to 0°C than from 15° C to 0° C ? I highly doubt that.

Slave 1 · Post by **Slave 1** » 30 Nov 2007, 23:44

Grinser wrote:So it would take less time to cool water from lets say 50° Celsius to 0°C than from 15° C to 0° C ? I highly doubt that.

Tis true, try it.

anode505 · Post by **anode505** » 01 Dec 2007, 00:36

The steps in keys are 1/64th of an inch (ie: about .017 " )

The EC cycles of freezing a key will not deform or warp a key. (well might if the key is hot when immersed into, say, liquid nitrogen, or cooled equivalently as fast)

davisev5225 · Post by **davisev5225** » 01 Dec 2007, 10:52

Grinser wrote:So it would take less time to cool water from lets say 50° Celsius to 0°C than from 15° C to 0° C ? I highly doubt that.

It's chemistry. Water freezes by losing atomic energy until the atoms are in an almost suspended state. The more energy there is to lose, the faster it is lost.

Go ask a chemistry professor.

anode505 · Post by **anode505** » 01 Dec 2007, 13:51

Grinser wrote:So it would take less time to cool water from lets say 50° Celsius to 0°C than from 15° C to 0° C ? I highly doubt that.

not sure of freezing, but cold water boils faster then warm/hot. i think it has to do with thermal acceleration.

Cindy123 · Post by **Cindy123** » 01 Dec 2007, 23:04

All of this is way over my head, who cares how long it takes to freeze, I care how long it takes to melt.

Sin

tieman · Post by **tieman** » 02 Dec 2007, 02:05

Sorry folks but here is the word from the engineer. (Not trying to sound too superior but this is what I do). It takes energy to cool form a high temp to a low temp. Doesn't matter F or C. Once the liquid reaches the lowest temp, say 0 degrees C, then the energy required is a lot more to freeze the liquid (conversely the energy to Boil).

Technical story short, the amount of energy to thaw is a lot compared to the energy to reach the thaw temp from a higher one.

Doesn't matter, when I am waiting for something to freeze for my escapades, it always takes a long time. Watched pot and all that.

Charlie tuna · Post by **Charlie tuna** » 02 Dec 2007, 03:42

heated water will freeze faster than cold water because most of the disolved minnerals and impurities have been boiled out.
Minnerals and impurities act like an antifreeze.
I worked in an ice skating rink for 17 years always used hot water in the zamboni (ice resurfacer) , if we wanted to use cold water, we needed to add an aditive to bind the impurities.

Grinser · Post by **Grinser** » 02 Dec 2007, 16:00

alright, but thats not about the temperature then, its about the water quality. So if you want your water to freeze quickly, take pure, distilled water, not water from the tap or a bottle.

Toszum · Post by **Toszum** » 02 Dec 2007, 16:15

The fact that water freeezes faster after boiling can not be connected to the minerals being boiled out.

This is impossible since when boiling pure H2O steam rises from the water thereby elevating the mineral concentration within.

The reason I read why boiling water will freeze faster is that when water is beeing cooled from boiling hot to freezing cold the crisatlline structure of ice can form more homogenously. The exact explanation was given but since I am not a physicist I didn't fully understand it.

Dark_Lizerd · Post by **Dark_Lizerd** » 03 Dec 2007, 15:51

When I was younger I lived in an older house with less that required insulation... In the winter we always left the hot water dripping, if not the pipes would freeze and sometimes burst...
But the cold water pipes never froze....
And about the distilled water, I know from "Myth Busters" that distilled water can be heated above 212 F, or 100 C... and adding anything to it will cause the water to boil...
Wonder if the same is true about freezing it...
And we all know that salty water is still liquid below 32 F....