Cheap(ish) key timer options

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ruru67
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Cheap(ish) key timer options

Post by ruru67 »

Just a quick survey of cheap timer locks for locking up keys et c for self-bondage. All these are obtainable via AliExpress - which tens to be my go-to for cheap-arse products, but pretty much all of these will be available via Amazon or eBay or other platforms.

I note that vendors tend to use the same or similar descriptions on multiple platforms so copying/pasting a description to the site of your choice will probably get you much the same item. Also, I haven't tried to find the best deal - shop around.

None of this should be read as an endorsement of any platform or product.

Timer padlocks

Two basic types, the plastic ones and the metal ones. These have been discussed fairly extensively on this site:
  • Plastic padlocks. These became available first. They have a cable and a catch, which is disabled when the timer is running - that means you can't start the timer and then lock it, you have to lock it then start the timer. You also need to be able to operate the catch to release the padlock. The physical weak point is the cable; the ends are crimped over the plastic sheath, and can pull out if enough force can be applied, e.g. by twisting the lock against the cable. An example product is this or this - note different body styles but basically the same mechanism.
  • Metal padlocks. these have a metal body and hasp, with very similar controls and display to the plastic versions. They are mechanically very different, using a motor to retract a spring loaded catch, so you can start the timers and verify the time is correct before actually locking them. They have a couple of ways of escaping them (see the thread). Example product listing here
I've seen other timer padlocks, also app-driven BlueTooth padlocks which allegedly have timer functionality. Does anyone know much about these?

I've used both the above locks extensively. The following products are just what I've seen while poking around AliExpress recently; I haven't bought any of them and don't have any info other than what I've seen on the site.

"Kitchen safes"

These seem to be low-cost knock-offs (in terms of functionality) to the Kitchen Safe or KSafe (which is also an option). They're aimed at keeping yourself or others out of treats, addictive substances (e.g. to help quit smoking, lose weight et c), or as a "phone jail" (e.g. to keep kids off phones during meal times).
  • Older, round model. This has a 999 hour (plus 59 minute) timer (as opposed to the 99 hour timer on the padlocks above). Plastic, so probably won't last long if you really need to break into it.
  • Larger square plastic box. I think I saw a comment suggesting this has 12 day limit. It's pretty big. Also, a number of listings for this item also show a nastly 3-digit combination version, and some suggestion that occasionally this has been shipped instead of the timer version. Vent holes may allow keys to be reached.
  • Metal time-lock box. I like the look of this one; just saw it recently (and it kinda prompted this post). This seems pretty solid, and has a 365 day timer on it. The batteries are 4xAA, and it has a USB-C power socket as well. There are a couple of sizes. There is a charger cable hole (i.e. for charging an enclosed device) that might be a problem (not sure how big it is), although it might also serve as a place to attach an anchor chain...
Portable Phone Jails

These are intended to lock you away from fiddling with your phone, e.g. to allow you to study, and are therefore about phone sized - which means they're much smaller than the above boxes.

Most have finger holes to allow you to answer a call; to use as a key lock you juts need to have something you can drop into the box to block the holes, or some come without them, for example this box has models both with and without the finger holes.

Cigarette timers

This device is intended to hold a pack of cigarettes to aid in slowing down consumption. It's small and portable, and fairly cheap, but I'm not sure how its user interface works - there are +, - and SET buttons (rather than, say, Hour, Minute & Lock), and a display of HHH:MM for the time.

If anyone buys any of these (or something similar), please post a response as to how well it worked...
Last edited by ruru67 on 22 Nov 2023, 04:07, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Cheap(ish) key timer options

Post by Sergio »

Good summary.

Here's another phone jail which I bought for somewhat less IIRC a couple of years ago. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004984666125.html

The holes would obviously allow keys to be withdrawn but putting them in a cassette case or similar box prevents that.

Also, I've created a 3D printed sleeve for the metal timer padlock to prevent the bypass to which you allude.
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Re: Cheap(ish) key timer options

Post by Kinbaku »

It's great that everything is now together nicely. Thanks.
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Re: Cheap(ish) key timer options

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Sergio wrote: 21 Nov 2023, 13:57Here's another phone jail which I bought for somewhat less IIRC a couple of years ago. https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004984666125.html
There's a whole bunch of phone jails, I just picked one that could be bought without the finger holes. Most of them open at the end, so if you cut a piece of wood to fit the bottom half of the box (and make it fit closely enough that it can't be turned or a key slipped past it), the keys can sit in the top half of the box secure from being retrieved.

(I have a feeling we discussed this here some time ago.)
The holes would obviously allow keys to be withdrawn but putting them in a cassette case or similar box prevents that.
Now you'll have to explain to the young 'uns what a cassette case is...
Also, I've created a 3D printed sleeve for the metal timer padlock to prevent the bypass to which you allude.
Was that to avoid shimming them or to fix the tapping problem (where you can put a little upward pressure on the hasp, then tap the left hand side of the lock sharply a few times and it'll open)? I made little sleeves to make the former more difficult, but the only solution to the latter I've found is to use them in situations where the lock body is held away from any hard surfaces, and you don't have access to anything to tap it with.

The feature I most want in a lock box is the ability to add time before it unlocks. I believe current versions the KSafe can do that. Another thing that I saw a comment suggesting the KSafe can do is pause the timer - so you can the timer for, say, an hour, then pause it - it stays locked for as long as you want, then when you want to open it you have to un-pause it and wait for it to count down. (I bought a Kitchen Safe off the first production run in 2013, so it didn't have any fancy features.)
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Re: Cheap(ish) key timer options

Post by Sergio »

Spoiler warning - I'll explain the padlock sleeve further down.

I have one each of both the original and current k-safes. In both cases the feature that you can change the battery with the safe locked and it resumes where it left off means you can remove the battery holder to freeze the countdown. The new one allows time to be added by pressing (IIRC) and turning the dial and then pressing again to confirm but the original doesn't.

spolier follows...

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The timer padlock like some of the cheaper k-safe copies, has a 'feature' that it can be opened by holding the H and M buttons together for ten seconds, which makes it kind of pointless. So I've made a sleeve that slides sideways over the body to cover those buttons, leaving the display and lock/unlock button accessible. The hasp closes through a hole in the sleeve to prevent it being removed. I also considered a variation which hides the hours and perhaps even the minutes, so you can only estimate the time remaining. I'll maybe put it on Thingiverse once I've tested a few more as the tolerances are quite close. Can we send files via this forum? It's in OpenSCAD which is basically text.
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Re: Cheap(ish) key timer options

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Sergio wrote: 22 Nov 2023, 17:36 The timer padlock like some of the cheaper k-safe copies, has a 'feature' that it can be opened by holding the H and M buttons together for ten seconds, which makes it kind of pointless. So I've made a sleeve that slides sideways over the body to cover those buttons, leaving the display and lock/unlock button accessible. The hasp closes through a hole in the sleeve to prevent it being removed. I also considered a variation which hides the hours and perhaps even the minutes, so you can only estimate the time remaining. I'll maybe put it on Thingiverse once I've tested a few more as the tolerances are quite close. Can we send files via this forum? It's in OpenSCAD which is basically text.
No need for spoilers - in fact people should know. (It's also in the paper leaflet that comes with the locks.)

The "emergency unlock" can only be used three times, at least on the padlocks I have. After the third use, H+M no longer works, and that remains the case until the lock is reset or the battery runs right down. So you just lock them and H+M release them three times (and a fourth with a short lock time just to be sure it no longer works) and you're good to go.

I have thought about some kind of sheath that would cushion the lock to protect it against the tapping attack that the metal-bodied locks are vulnerable to.

Read right through this thread - it has pretty much everything I and others have learned about these locks...
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Re: Cheap(ish) key timer options

Post by Sergio »

ruru67 wrote: 22 Nov 2023, 23:03 (It's also in the paper leaflet that comes with the locks.)
None of mine came with anything but a bit of bubble wrap. Certainly no instructions let alone a box. Chinese mailing efficiency at its best. :-)

The shroud also prevents tampering with the display to gain access to the reset hole. I shall try the tapping attack when I have a moment.
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Re: Cheap(ish) key timer options

Post by eki »

I think the original post misses two categories. Realtors boxes (analog or digital) and kink-oriented lockboxes like the PiVault and our own https://embeddedkink.com/lockbox.html
Of course, both options reduce how far you can limit mobility but that hasn't been the biggest factor in my experience, especially when accounting for having an emergency release anyway
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Re: Cheap(ish) key timer options

Post by ruru67 »

eki wrote: 24 Nov 2023, 22:48I think the original post misses two categories. Realtors boxes (analog or digital) and kink-oriented lockboxes like the PiVault and our own https://embeddedkink.com/lockbox.html
I don't think it counts as a "miss" if one wasn't actually aiming for those...

I did actually look for realtors boxes, but I didn't see any that had a timer feature. It's possible that some "smart" Bluetooth enabled devices have some kind of timer capability, but if there was it wasn't easily apparent.

I was specifically looking for cheap and easily available options intended for mainstream use. I note that neither the EKI nor PiVault have active Etsy listings (kinda hard to determine if it's "cheap" with no price available). I struggle to call these really commercial products, at least not ones that I could have confidence will have any commercial longevity.

All power to you or anyone putting such products together, but it just isn't what this post is about.

I'd also avoided products like time-locked safes such as this one as being out of the "cheap" price range. All the options above are in the US$50 or less range.

Oh, here's another option in the "kitchen safe" type category: https://www.amazon.com/Mindsight-Portab ... B0C3JNXD56
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