Preparing a larger session... or sessions.

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Preparing a larger session... or sessions.

Postby Aurora Borealis » 14 Apr 2009, 03:10

If everything works out well, I'll have the flat for myself for about ten days in august.

This got me thinking about a longer session. No, not entire week or something like that (I'm not THAT crazy although the idea of a weekly imprisonment sounds intriguing), but I've been thinking of being somewhat restricted for between 12 to 48 hours.

What I'm thinking is partial sensory deprivation of sorts. A catsuit (preferably latex if I can afford one in time), high heels, and a hood (with uncovered mouth but no eyeholes) and enough cuffs and padlocks to restrict my movement (and make removal of clothing impossible without destroying it). Pondering some sort of chastity too.
This way I'd be trapped at home with just enough "access" to feed and empty myself.

There's just one problem (well, two actually).

What about a release? I'm thinking ice, something like freeze the keys in an empty 2L tub of icecream but I don't know whether that will even hold 12 hours, not to mention a longer time.

Obviously I am going to make tests to seehow long the ice will take to melt etc. (I can't do it just yet to avoid raising suspision, haha), but I'll ask just in case:
Is there something that can be added to ice to make last longer?

Secondary release is not that much of a problem. Since I'm not tied to any furniture/immobilized, in case of something bad happening all I have to do is leave my flat (and possibly traumatize the neighbors for good but hey, my life's more important than their nightmares :D )

Secondary problem is whether I can afford all the things that I want to use or not but there are workarounds (I've seen some nice posts on hoods, a set of dog collars can be used successfully as cuffs etc.) so that's not as important right now.

So yeah, any suggestions for the ice problem? alternative release of some sort? I don't want anything that requires electricity or can break easily (ice seems the safest here). Any other suggestions? comments? thoughts? ideas? improvements? :D
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Postby thedude » 14 Apr 2009, 04:59

That's a tough one... the best, most reliable thing I could recommend would be to try something like locking the fridge closed somehow, then having the key to /that/ lock in its own ice release. Even then, you're only looking at double the length of your current release.

Better might be to confide in someone--have them help you set a combo lock so you don't know the combination, and have a backup that's unpleasant, but available in case your confidant turns out to be of bad character. Then use the combo lock to secure the key someplace where you can't use it. I'd do this by setting up a webcam and setting it that way, so that they can see the combo, and you can't. Have them write it down, then scramble it. They could give you the combo back at the end of the time limit via email, SMS, phone, anything.

On a side note, I'm willing to help with that, but I understand it's hard to trust anyone (especially via the internet). If you're at all interested though, PM me, and we could talk it over.

Another idea might be to use numbered plastic locks, like the telephone company uses. Use one to hide your key, and post a picture of it here when you start the scenario. Then, at the end of the scenario, ask someone to post a five-digit number. Copy that onto a paper, then take a picture of that /and/ the lock (this makes sure you didn't get the key early, then hold on to the picture). The first picture would prove that you locked yourself up on time.. the second picture would prove that you stayed locked until time was up. It's not the same, I know... but there would be /some/ incentive not to cheat.

Let us know what you come up with! :D
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Postby onestrangeguy » 14 Apr 2009, 05:12

It depends uppon how big your freezer is...
Really big blocks of ice can take days to freeze through (Solid)!
I'm not sure about melt times. :wink: !
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Postby Aurora Borealis » 14 Apr 2009, 05:30

thedude wrote:That's a tough one... the best, most reliable thing I could recommend would be to try something like locking the fridge closed somehow, then having the key to /that/ lock in its own ice release. Even then, you're only looking at double the length of your current release.

That could actually work. I wish I had a second fridge :lol:


Anything using internet is out since I plan on being blindfolded (might have not been clear enough on this one). Also, that includes relying on electronics


thedude wrote:Let us know what you come up with! :D

Of course :)
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Postby Aurora Borealis » 14 Apr 2009, 05:34

onestrangeguy wrote:It depends uppon how big your freezer is...
Really big blocks of ice can take days to freeze through (Solid)!
I'm not sure about melt times. :wink: !


It's not that big, but I should be able to freeze a 2L box... that's about as much water as in 6 cans of soda.

I decided to measure one empty icecream package and it's 6x4x4.5inch.

that should take at least couple of hours to melt, right? :D
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Making ice last longer

Postby Audrey_CD » 14 Apr 2009, 06:28

During the second world war something called piecrete was developed to make ice last longer. This is done by adding sawdust to the water before freezing it.

Information here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piecrete

I imagine once defrosted, you would need to make sure that no sawdust got transferred into the the lock...
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Postby lj » 14 Apr 2009, 08:24

just insulate the ice :)

make a thick box out of polystyrene. Builders suppliers and big DIY stores will stock sheet 50 or 100mm thick, use gaffer tape to make up the box, with the vital key on a string through a small hole in the box, then put the box out of reach.

No idea how long it will delay the thawing, so experiment :!:
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Postby wormblaster » 14 Apr 2009, 08:30

Don´t forget to take other security measures not entirely relacted do self-bondage itself.
Turn off everything you don´t need, like the gas for instance, and unplug all the electric´s equipment you would turn off, when there is a Blizzard Storm.

Besiedes that... will your neighbours know you are at home or...? Will they expect that?... what you gonna do if someone rings at the door, or the phone?... Things like that.
:-)

You cannot disapeare for 2 entire days, can you? Perhaps you can... I don´t know about your life :D
Last edited by wormblaster on 14 Apr 2009, 17:29, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Preparing a larger session... or sessions.

Postby Aurora Borealis » 14 Apr 2009, 16:14

Audrey_CD wrote:During the second world war something called piecrete was developed to make ice last longer. This is done by adding sawdust to the water before freezing it.



Information here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piecrete



I imagine once defrosted, you would need to make sure that no sawdust got transferred into the the lock...


I looked into it and it seems it lasts longer than ice in low temperatures, but in normal room temperatures I might get an extra hour or two out of it? I'll have to do experiments since all the ones I read were done either on icecubes/frozen cups

lj wrote:just insulate the ice :)



make a thick box out of polystyrene. Builders suppliers and big DIY stores will stock sheet 50 or 100mm thick, use gaffer tape to make up the box, with the vital key on a string through a small hole in the box, then put the box out of reach.



No idea how long it will delay the thawing, so experiment :!:


Hmm, I'll look into that too. I read that if you put a container of ice into water with ice and salt, it'll keep cool longer cause that salty, icy water limits the amount of heat that gets to the ice in the box (that's how they used to keep icecream cold). Another thing to experiment with :D

wormblaster wrote:Don´t forget to take other security measures not entirely relacted do self-bondage itself.

Turn off everything you don´t need, like the gas for instance, and unplug all the electric´s equipment you would turn off, when there is a Blizzard Storm.



Besiedes that... will your neighbours know you are at home or...? Will they expect that?... what you gonna do if someone rings at the door, or the phone?... Things like that.

:-)



You cannot disapeare for 2 entire days, can you? Perhaps you can... I don´t about your life :D


Yep yep, I know. Electricity's off (wouldn't have much use for it as I can't operate the pc without seeing the screen, haha... and obviously light or tv would be wasted on me too). I'm also making two of the rooms off-limits (too many cables on the floor, last thing I want to do is trip and pulldown my pc from the desk) and hiding anything breakable in cupboards/drawers.

Disappearing for two days? Not a problem. They'll probably assume I left with the rest of family and I'll just have to inform my friends that I'm out for two days (can't use them as a backup anyway since the doors open from outside only with a key). Officially I'm out of house :D

- - -

Thanks for the suggestions so far. If anyone has an already tested "ice delay" trick please share, meanwhile I'll try to test out sawdust, isolation and salty water without rising suspicions :D
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Re: Preparing a larger session... or sessions.

Postby thedude » 14 Apr 2009, 16:29

I couldn't find a good link for the episode, but Mythbusters did something like that. They wanted to see how they could chill a beer the quickest, and tried ice, ice water, the freezer, saltwater and ice, etc. The fastest by far was saltwater with ice. You may have also noticed salt used to /melt/ ice on sidewalks in wintertime... something that's contradictory on the surface.

Why do they both work? Salt lowers the freezing point of ice. (It also lowers the boiling point, hence its use in high-altitude and cold-weather cooking where boiling water is needed.) On your icy sidewalk, this means that the ice itself will liquefy, even at its lower temperature. In saltwater with ice, it allows the water itself to get much colder than it normally should be able to. However, this won't do anything to help keep your ice solid (actually, it'll do the opposite as the salt from the surrounding water transfers into the ice block, I would expect). If you were to do something like this, I'd recommend putting your ice in something like a double boiler, except you won't heat the outer dish... just fill it with the iced saltwater, then float the ice in the upper layer. The key is to have some type of waterproof material separating your saltwater from your ice. You might even get two differently-sized styrofoam coolers, then float one in the other that way (though, you might want to weight it at the bottom, so the salty part covers as much of the outside of the inner vessel as much as possible).

Related: I'm intrigued by this Pykrete business... plan on running a couple experiments of my own, and will report what I find.
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Re: Preparing a larger session... or sessions.

Postby Aurora Borealis » 14 Apr 2009, 19:04

Thanks for the additional info.

thedude wrote:If you were to do something like this, I'd recommend putting your ice in something like a double boiler, except you won't heat the outer dish... just fill it with the iced saltwater, then float the ice in the upper layer. The key is to have some type of waterproof material separating your saltwater from your ice. You might even get two differently-sized styrofoam coolers, then float one in the other that way (though, you might want to weight it at the bottom, so the salty part covers as much of the outside of the inner vessel as much as possible).

I plan on freezing my ice in plastic icecream tub type thing. The question is (assuming I get a box or container that's large enough to hold the icecream one) how do I seal it off so that I can't spill the salty water but still can reach the key once the ice is melted.

note to self: get some rubber/latex gloves as putting fabric gloves into icy watermight be a bit too much. :lol:

thedude wrote:Related: I'm intrigued by this Pykrete business... plan on running a couple experiments of my own, and will report what I find.

Please do. :D
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Re: Preparing a larger session... or sessions.

Postby RADER » 14 Apr 2009, 19:23

You can freeze the key in your icecreem container, then when good and hard, put the container
in the refergrator, like (defrosting the Turkey at Thanksgiving) it could take over 24 hours.
A 2nd idea to that is to put the icecreem container in an insulated lunch box or small cooler;
Than put it in the refergator, that will shurley take over 24 hours.
Test it out before you start; Safty First. :idea:
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Re: Preparing a larger session... or sessions.

Postby thedude » 15 Apr 2009, 21:28

Pykrete progress!

Sort of. I was able to find a good source of sawdust (which /is/ actually a concern, since I'm an apartment-dweller). I called the local lumberyard, and they're more than happy for me to sweep some up--only today's no good because of wet weather. Saturday's the day.

My 'cover story' is that it's for a college research project, building a canoe like in the wikipedia article. :wink:

More to follow...
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Re: Preparing a larger session... or sessions.

Postby Lost Soul » 15 Apr 2009, 21:29

I had an interesting thought while researching Ice and various other things to try and help you out, and here is what my somewhat insane mind has spawned for your consideration. It's kind of a mish-mash of everything that people have contributed so far.

You will need the following materials:
Water (to make ice {duh})
Salt
Cheap styrofoam/polystyrene cooler (or a real one you don't care about destroying)
Random extra keys (For added difficulty)
Small weights (to tie to the keys)

Ok, I know a picture is worth a thousand words, so I drew one up real quick and shot it, then edited it a bit in photoshop. Sorry, I'm not an artist. :oops: Image

The idea here is that you fill the cooler full of ice, water, and salt. (Leave room for an extra 2L of water, and the displacement of your arms, unless you want to make a big mess...) :shock: This lowers the freezing point of the water, and you will have super-cold water that is literally painful to leave your hand (or other appendage) in. Cut a hole in the lid just slightly smaller than the bottom dimensions of your ice cream container. Throw your random extra keys in the water, and put the lid on the cooler.

You take your ice cream container. You have filled it with water and frozen it solid with your key inside. (Or you created pykrete. Ice is easier...) You now cut the bottom out of your ice cream container. I don't know about where you live, but you mentioned it was plastic. Most of the plastic containers where I am are slightly tapered. This will prevent the ice from simply falling out. Place the container over the hole so that it is just resting on the edges.

The block of ice melts, and the icemelt drains down into the cooler. When it finally melts all the way, the key will drop down into the freezing cold water, and you will have to remove the lid and fish for it. But, since you said you would be blindfolded, and all those extra keys are in there, it might take a few tries. :twisted: And since the water is freezing cold, you won't be leaving your hand in there for long periods of time.

Should an emergency happen, there is no reason you can't dump the cooler and get the keys immediately. The weights on them should prevent them from flowing away. If the key somehow gets hung up on the hole in the lid, or the bottom of the ice cream box, it's still accessible (and would actually get you out earlier). Obviously you should still use a backup of some sort, but I think this is fairly safe. The huge mess will prevent you from dumping the cooler just to get out early, and eventually the water will warm up to room temperature, allowing you to fish the key out at your leisure.

The only issues I can forsee with this release is that I don't know how long the water in the cooler will stay 'Painfully Cold' clearly testing is needed. The other issue I see is a problem where you could freeze your hands, like frostbite. I'm not a doctor, but I think it would be too uncomfortable to keep them in water that cold long enough to cause damage.

Anyway, just my thoughts for your review. Feel free to poke holes in the theory if you like. I have been known to be wrong from time to time. :)
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Re: Preparing a larger session... or sessions.

Postby thedude » 15 Apr 2009, 21:33

Lost Soul wrote:Anyway, just my thoughts for your review. Feel free to poke holes in the theory if you like. I have been known to be wrong from time to time. :)


It looks good to me except that I'd think the ice up top would take a good long time to melt, as well... so by the time it did, the water below might be close to room temp.
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