Hello all.
I have limited handy man type skills and was wondering what process is required to set up an electro magnet for self bondage.
Could someone please explain what is required using simple instructions.
Thanks so much.
cheers
Fossill
Could someone explain for me, how to use Electro magnets?
Could someone explain for me, how to use Electro magnets?
Last edited by Sir Cumference on 29 Oct 2014, 12:58, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: headline improved
Reason: headline improved
Re: Electro magnets
Hello fossil,
Generally there are two types of electromagnets:
The first type is a "normal" magnet, that will turn non-magnetic once current runs through it. NEVER use those in Selfbondage, as they are NOT FAIL-SAFE.
If there's a flaw in the circuitry the magnet WILL NOT RELEASE!
The second type works vice versa. As long as current flows, there`s a magnetic field generated. As soon as the current is switched off, the magnet releases.
Assuming the use of the second type you don't need much for the most basic setup. This would be:
A) The magnet,
B) a power-supply that delivers the right voltage for the magnet and is capable of delivering enough current and finally
C) some wires to connect A and B.
BUT: In this setup the magnet will stay powered for as long as the power supply can deliver enough current. This can be fairly long (and still desirable?) to ultimately way too long (read weeks and more).
So you'll most likely want some sort of switching device between the magnet and the power supply. These could be anything from a simple switch to sophisticated high end electronics. Many members here (including myself) approach that part by using microcontrollers like e.g. the arduino-boards.
Options are too many here to outline them all.
The last but maybe most important thing to consider is the power supply itself.
As stated above the voltage ratings of the magnet and the supply should match exactly. if the supply delivered too much voltage you'll fry your magnet. If it delivered too low voltage the magnet won't be nearly as strong as it should be.
The magnet will draw current from the power supply. So the supply will need to be able to deliver enough current. Else you'll fry the supply.
You can calculate the current drawn by the magnet (if you know it's resistance) with the help of Ohms law: Voltage = Resistance * Current (or in short U = R*I).
The safest way to adress the power supply issue is to use batteries. They have the enormous advantage to be able to run out of power. They will run out of power at some point.
There's transformators for almost every desired voltage/current that can be plugged into wall outlets. These have the advantage/problem alike that they won't run out of power. Less cost on the one hand, less backup safety on the other.
They do however have another problem. It can happen that mains voltage "leaks" through the trafo. That would A) fry your magnet and surrounding circuit and B) possibly fry you.
Thus I'd recommend to stick to a battery-based solution.
I hope this helps a bit? Else feel free to ask!
Generally there are two types of electromagnets:
The first type is a "normal" magnet, that will turn non-magnetic once current runs through it. NEVER use those in Selfbondage, as they are NOT FAIL-SAFE.
If there's a flaw in the circuitry the magnet WILL NOT RELEASE!
The second type works vice versa. As long as current flows, there`s a magnetic field generated. As soon as the current is switched off, the magnet releases.
Assuming the use of the second type you don't need much for the most basic setup. This would be:
A) The magnet,
B) a power-supply that delivers the right voltage for the magnet and is capable of delivering enough current and finally
C) some wires to connect A and B.
BUT: In this setup the magnet will stay powered for as long as the power supply can deliver enough current. This can be fairly long (and still desirable?) to ultimately way too long (read weeks and more).
So you'll most likely want some sort of switching device between the magnet and the power supply. These could be anything from a simple switch to sophisticated high end electronics. Many members here (including myself) approach that part by using microcontrollers like e.g. the arduino-boards.
Options are too many here to outline them all.
The last but maybe most important thing to consider is the power supply itself.
As stated above the voltage ratings of the magnet and the supply should match exactly. if the supply delivered too much voltage you'll fry your magnet. If it delivered too low voltage the magnet won't be nearly as strong as it should be.
The magnet will draw current from the power supply. So the supply will need to be able to deliver enough current. Else you'll fry the supply.
You can calculate the current drawn by the magnet (if you know it's resistance) with the help of Ohms law: Voltage = Resistance * Current (or in short U = R*I).
The safest way to adress the power supply issue is to use batteries. They have the enormous advantage to be able to run out of power. They will run out of power at some point.
There's transformators for almost every desired voltage/current that can be plugged into wall outlets. These have the advantage/problem alike that they won't run out of power. Less cost on the one hand, less backup safety on the other.
They do however have another problem. It can happen that mains voltage "leaks" through the trafo. That would A) fry your magnet and surrounding circuit and B) possibly fry you.
Thus I'd recommend to stick to a battery-based solution.
I hope this helps a bit? Else feel free to ask!
If the doors of perception were cleansed everything would appear to man as it is, infinite. (W. Blake)
Re: Electro magnets
Impressive masterclass in electromagnets Blacky
Re: Electro magnets
That's either sarcasm or way too kind!qwerty212 wrote:Impressive masterclass in electromagnets Blacky
Edit: Improved wording to prevent misunderstanding.
If the doors of perception were cleansed everything would appear to man as it is, infinite. (W. Blake)
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Sir Cumference
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Re: Electro magnets
The eternal problem with online communication!
Is he genuine or is it sarcasm?
But I second Qwerty in being genuine. Very nice walk-through!
From a safety point of view, this is important:
Watt = voltage * current
It is perfectly all right, as long as it is able to get rid of the heat.
Too high a voltage for too long, and you'll fry the magnet.
Batteries are good, but if you draw too much current from them or short circuit them, they may explode or catch fire!
A well constructed power supply should fail safe, but even Apples costly ones have been able to burn.
It is sad to loose your magnet or power supply but even worse to start a fire when you are tied up!
Is he genuine or is it sarcasm?
But I second Qwerty in being genuine. Very nice walk-through!
From a safety point of view, this is important:
The magnet will get hot when you run current through it!The magnet will draw current from the power supply. So the supply will need to be able to deliver enough current. Else you'll fry the supply.
Watt = voltage * current
It is perfectly all right, as long as it is able to get rid of the heat.
Too high a voltage for too long, and you'll fry the magnet.
Batteries are good, but if you draw too much current from them or short circuit them, they may explode or catch fire!
A well constructed power supply should fail safe, but even Apples costly ones have been able to burn.
It is sad to loose your magnet or power supply but even worse to start a fire when you are tied up!
~ Leatherworking, blacksmithing , woodworking and programming are the most pervertable skills you can learn! ~
Re: Could someone explain for me, how to use Electro magnets
The only other thing I would add, I have used electro magnets on batteries to hold keys, eg to the ceiling, or high shelf.
Even when disconnected there can be enough residual polarised magnetism to hold a lightweight key,
so add a couple of layers of folded paper or similar to ensure the contact is broken at the end.
Note this is mainly an issue when using DC (or batteries), less of an issue when using AC.
Also, always test your release mechanism to death before adding yourself into the mix.
Even when disconnected there can be enough residual polarised magnetism to hold a lightweight key,
so add a couple of layers of folded paper or similar to ensure the contact is broken at the end.
Note this is mainly an issue when using DC (or batteries), less of an issue when using AC.
Also, always test your release mechanism to death before adding yourself into the mix.
Re: Could someone explain for me, how to use Electro magnets
The issues pointed out by Sir Cumeference and gemt are definetly important ones.
Anyways I forgot to mention an essential problem that occurs when using electro-magnets (and any other inductive loads) when run on DC-current:
The primary intention with all these devices is: Run current through them and receive a magnetic field in return. So far, so nice and easy. Let's assume you don't want the magnetic field anymore (e.g. to release your keys).
To achieve that you shut down the current creating the magnetic field. That leads to the collapse of the magnetic field (as desired), BUT:
The collapsing magnetic field will induce another current through the coil that originally generated the magnetic field. This current can be fairly large and should be taken care of. The easiest way to do so is to use a diode, clamped onto the coil in such way that it does not allow current to pass it while the power supply is switched on. It the automatically is installed in the right way to let the free induction current run through it by short-circuiting the coil.
A bit of care is needed though.
The diode should be placed as closely to the coil as possible. Furthermore, the energy conserved in the magnetic field will be transformed into heat at the diode. For most electromagnets I found a simple 1N4001 or 1N4007 diode to be good enough. These can handle currents of up to 1A. If you intend to use large magnets you ought to consider diodes capable of handling higher current.
This "trickery" becomes essential if you use a microcontroller to switch the magnet. Leave the diode out and you'll most likely destroy the controller. Nasty, stinky and expensive.
P.S.:
Wich reminds me of a nice quote from a friend of mine:
"Electronics only works with magic smoke. Once the smoke evoked, electronics won't work no more!"
P.P.S.: If I find the time to create them and someone has use for them I'll provide some basic schematics for both my first post and this one.
Anyways I forgot to mention an essential problem that occurs when using electro-magnets (and any other inductive loads) when run on DC-current:
The primary intention with all these devices is: Run current through them and receive a magnetic field in return. So far, so nice and easy. Let's assume you don't want the magnetic field anymore (e.g. to release your keys).
To achieve that you shut down the current creating the magnetic field. That leads to the collapse of the magnetic field (as desired), BUT:
The collapsing magnetic field will induce another current through the coil that originally generated the magnetic field. This current can be fairly large and should be taken care of. The easiest way to do so is to use a diode, clamped onto the coil in such way that it does not allow current to pass it while the power supply is switched on. It the automatically is installed in the right way to let the free induction current run through it by short-circuiting the coil.
A bit of care is needed though.
The diode should be placed as closely to the coil as possible. Furthermore, the energy conserved in the magnetic field will be transformed into heat at the diode. For most electromagnets I found a simple 1N4001 or 1N4007 diode to be good enough. These can handle currents of up to 1A. If you intend to use large magnets you ought to consider diodes capable of handling higher current.
This "trickery" becomes essential if you use a microcontroller to switch the magnet. Leave the diode out and you'll most likely destroy the controller. Nasty, stinky and expensive.
P.S.:
Wich reminds me of a nice quote from a friend of mine:
"Electronics only works with magic smoke. Once the smoke evoked, electronics won't work no more!"
P.P.S.: If I find the time to create them and someone has use for them I'll provide some basic schematics for both my first post and this one.
If the doors of perception were cleansed everything would appear to man as it is, infinite. (W. Blake)
Re: Could someone explain for me, how to use Electro magnets
thx for all the replies.
think I will stick with ice release.
cheers
fossill
think I will stick with ice release.
cheers
fossill
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merlot_vin
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Re: Could someone explain for me, how to use Electro magnets
Blacky, I would like to see the schematics (per your offer).
Re: Could someone explain for me, how to use Electro magnets
I'll create them asap. With a bit of luck that means today.merlot_vin wrote:Blacky, I would like to see the schematics (per your offer).
If the doors of perception were cleansed everything would appear to man as it is, infinite. (W. Blake)
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Tenderfoot88
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Re: Could someone explain for me, how to use Electro magnets
Which, in turn, reminds me of Lucas Replacement Smoke - seen here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wl4FOCK3fWYBlacky wrote:P.S.:
Wich reminds me of a nice quote from a friend of mine:
"Electronics only works with magic smoke. Once the smoke evoked, electronics won't work no more!"
Allows you to add smoke to your collectible car with a Lucas electrical system for car shows for added authenticity.
The original story I heard was better - a gag product in which you buy the smoke and pour it on your broken electronics and it fixes it by putting the smoke back in.
Re: Could someone explain for me, how to use Electro magnets
If only it worked. I'd simply have to have that!Tenderfoot88 wrote: The original story I heard was better - a gag product in which you buy the smoke and pour it on your broken electronics and it fixes it by putting the smoke back in.
As I was asked for them, here are some very basic schematics adding to my prior posts here. A little late, but maybe they are still of use?
Step 1: A simple connection of the coil and the battery. The green lines indicate the wires.
Step 2: Added a switch. This could be an actual switch or whatever other switching device you want to use. Please make sure it's designed for both the applied voltage AND the current drawn by the coil.
Step 3: Added a diode. This will short circuit the coil while the magnetic field collapses. DO NOT USE THIS SETUP FOR AC! It's absolutely DC-specific!
P.S.: Sorry for the size of the image. I just couldn't find/remember how to embed pics as thumbnails. Would someone please help me? Thanks a lot!
If the doors of perception were cleansed everything would appear to man as it is, infinite. (W. Blake)
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Sir Cumference
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- Location: Scandinavia
Re: Could someone explain for me, how to use Electro magnets
No need to thumbnail. I actually like to view the pictures directly.
Sketch #3 is especially important if it is any kind of electronic device that does the job as a "switch".
The reverse current induced by the collapsing magnetic field, could otherwise fry a microcontroller, transistor or the like.
Sketch #3 is especially important if it is any kind of electronic device that does the job as a "switch".
The reverse current induced by the collapsing magnetic field, could otherwise fry a microcontroller, transistor or the like.
~ Leatherworking, blacksmithing , woodworking and programming are the most pervertable skills you can learn! ~
Re: Could someone explain for me, how to use Electro magnets
I would like to offer a different viewpoint, with respect to power from the mains.
The electromagnet will most likely require DC voltage, so there will be a power supply involved. Any decent power supply will have adequate isolation between the AC wall power and the electromagnet that you will be safe. You will be no more at risk than you would be from being electrocuted by your PC.
Powered off the AC can have an additional safety factor as well. If the power should fail, you are let out immediately. So if there is some big event, such as an earthquake or fire you will get released when the power fails.
I also highly recommend having multiple timers in the electrical circuit. One time I was using a single spring wound timer and it failed. It still had a about 5 minutes left when the stupid thing stopped ticking!
So now I always have two timers: One "short" for the duration I am looking for and another lamp timer that provides a larger window of time but will eventually let me out. It would not be difficult to add smoke detectors or other types of emergency release mechanisms as well.
I had an earlier post where I provided details and pictures of my electro-magnet setup. Check out:
http://forum.boundanna.net/board/viewto ... f=6&t=6994
Ron
The electromagnet will most likely require DC voltage, so there will be a power supply involved. Any decent power supply will have adequate isolation between the AC wall power and the electromagnet that you will be safe. You will be no more at risk than you would be from being electrocuted by your PC.
Powered off the AC can have an additional safety factor as well. If the power should fail, you are let out immediately. So if there is some big event, such as an earthquake or fire you will get released when the power fails.
I also highly recommend having multiple timers in the electrical circuit. One time I was using a single spring wound timer and it failed. It still had a about 5 minutes left when the stupid thing stopped ticking!
So now I always have two timers: One "short" for the duration I am looking for and another lamp timer that provides a larger window of time but will eventually let me out. It would not be difficult to add smoke detectors or other types of emergency release mechanisms as well.
I had an earlier post where I provided details and pictures of my electro-magnet setup. Check out:
http://forum.boundanna.net/board/viewto ... f=6&t=6994
Ron
Re: Could someone explain for me, how to use Electro magnets
"Decent" is a very important word here. In most cases you are absolutely right. In the other cases it's at least dangerous.rmcingle wrote:I would like to offer a different viewpoint, with respect to power from the mains.
The electromagnet will most likely require DC voltage, so there will be a power supply involved. Any decent power supply will have adequate isolation between the AC wall power and the electromagnet that you will be safe. You will be no more at risk than you would be from being electrocuted by your PC.
That's why I prefer to stay away from mains whenever possible. IMHO anyone who's not absolutely sure about what he/she does should always stay away from mains.
True. But I have the ultimate advantage of living in an area where both fire and earthquakes are highly unlikely. For me the risk of electrocution is much higher!Powered off the AC can have an additional safety factor as well. If the power should fail, you are let out immediately. So if there is some big event, such as an earthquake or fire you will get released when the power fails.
Anyhow: I admit that there`s a certain amount of safety added that way.
I second that. Backup safety is always a good idea.I also highly recommend having multiple timers in the electrical circuit.
Nice setup. And a very nice power supply.I had an earlier post where I provided details and pictures of my electro-magnet setup. Check out:
http://forum.boundanna.net/board/viewto ... f=6&t=6994
Ron
Thanks for your thoughts on this, Ron, as they clearly show that both ways have their (dis-)advantages.
If the doors of perception were cleansed everything would appear to man as it is, infinite. (W. Blake)
