Teasing to the edge, but denying orgasm

Selfbondage software and other kinky developments

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bondagepony
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Teasing to the edge, but denying orgasm

Post by bondagepony »

Hello everyone,

I have been lurking a long time. But I thought I should finally come out and ask some questions as well as tell a bit about me. I have been into bondage as long as I can remember and since I am lacking a partner and I started off with self bondage. My sessions started becoming more and more complex. Since I am a programmer and fine with electromechanics it was a short step for me to start using my computer to controll various vibrators. So now usually my sessions involved a vibrating buttplug as well as a vibrator motor taped near to my cockhead. I found that turning up the penis vibrator to a higher level would make me cum very fast. So in my sessions I played with various routines, always leaving the vibrator at my penis in a very low setting while allowing the buttplug near full power. I developed various programs that randomized the routines, had built in teases and "wait" phases without vibration as well as a "make me cum" button that i would push right after my release.

While this is really fun and frustrating for the bound person I was wondering if I could do some more fine tuning. I noticed (and by talking with others on various forums) I found that it is virtually impossible to cum without squeezing your pubic muscles. Those are the muscles that squeeze the anus and pump blood into the penis etc. I think all of you will know what I mean. Just try it when you are aroused and you squeeze your muscles you notice your penis twitch as well as feel more blood being forced into it. Go on and try coming without twitching your muscles. The more aroused you get the harder it is to hold back and when you are at the edge of orgasm you are FORCED to twitch your muscles right before you come (and of course during coming as well as this is the same muscles that are used for squirting). Often you will not be able to hold-back twitching even long before orgasm, but you can train yourself and if you finally give in the orgasms are really really intense. Among "experts" this is called "edging", eg. keeping close to orgasm all the time.

So my search went in how this muscle twitching could be detected. If I could reliably detect this twitching it would make it possible to vibrate myself right to the edge and detecting a muscle contraction stop the teasing right before orgasm was archived. I tried various different techniques. One try was via "penile plethysmography". There is a company in the US that produces tiny rubber wires that are filled with a form of liquid metal (Indium Gllium gauges, http://www.btimonarch.com/catalog/indium-gallium.php) When the wire is stretched the resistance goes up. I build a small electric board to amplify those changes and tried it on my penis. It worked very well since during a twitch the penis increases in diameter. I was sure I had found the holy-grail of all self-bondage fans. Anyway however there were several downsides. The sensor was so sensitive it picked up the vibrations of the vibrator. Also since the diameter of the penis changes quite a lot from flacid to stiff the sensor needed continous adjustment to the "current state". And the wire itself was built for single use and felt so delicate that it might have ripped after some time.

So my search continued since i wanted the following:
- Detect the muscle twitch reliably
- Independant from Penis diameter
- Independant from wearer's "size"
- Usable with E-Stim (eg. resistant to e-noise from other devices)
- Resistant to motion of the body (eg. allow squirming, humping a bit etc. if there is no muscle contraction)

These constraints led me to a nice idea and final development. Instead of using various mechanical parts or magnets or whatever came to my mind the solution was quite simple. Using Light! ... So I built the following infrared-sensor which is quite similar to the sensors used to detect heartbeats in hospitals.
psensor_built_1.jpg
This is the sensor part of my development. As you can see it contains a infrared sender and receiver inside a tiny foamed housing. This device is then placed at the base of your penis right above the scrotum on the underside above the urethra. I use a small silicon sleeve to keep it in place. The sensor works by sending out a light pattern and detecting how much light goes through your skin. This amount of light differs depending on how much blood is flowing there. Look at this picture:
psensor.jpg
This signal is received by a circuit which amplifies it and does some further filtering (noise etc.). And then the signal is sent to my PC via a analog to digital interface.

I have tested this device now since several months and it has prooven to work so good in fact that it has totally changed the way I do bondage and also the way I behave during the bondage. When I locked myself into bondage with this sensor for the first time and watched porn while my penis vibrator drove me nuts and when I was about to orgasm and could not hold squeezing back anymore and when the vibrations stopped then I really really screamed my frustration into my gag. I have not felt something like this when playing alone. In all my scenarios since then (must have been 20-30 sessions) I was unable to come over the edge and have an orgasm, but I was constantly kept at the edge of "nearly" having an orgasm. I have also fine tuned the software to use with the vibrators and sensor now. The program plays a slideshow of teasing pictures, slowly increasing the arousal through the vibrator intensitiy raising until you are about to come. If you do ... then it can decide what to do ... eg. punish you with whatever means you can think about (eg. a long time without teasing, a whipping motor, a fucking machine, electro shocks, just butt-plug stimulation without penis, inflating gags, using pumps for various liquids, etc. etc.) it really is your choice.

Now I have a few questions for all you guys AND girls!
- Try it out on yourself, can you come without squeezing your muscles?
- Girls, several ppl. told me this muscle-squeeze before orgasm (and impossibility to cum without) works the same with the female body. Is this true and can you think of a place on your body to detect this squeezing? Is there a place eg. near the clit where you could feel a blood increase during such a squeeze?
- Would you be interested in such a device if it really works well?

The thing is I have been thinking for a long time (out of self-need as well) to open a small online-store with supplies regarding bondage and especial self-bondage. I know there are several stores out there, but they charge hillarious prices in my opionion and mostly for crappy stuff. I was thinking about a store for the community where beside other well tested and good equipment I could sell sellf made stuff like the above mentioned device together with circuit and software etc...

I just want to hear some opinions! (Perhaps I could give away some beta-test-set ;-))

Thank you a lot,
Your Pony
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qwerty212
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Re: Teasing to the edge, but denying orgasm

Post by qwerty212 »

Sounds very interesting. Thanks for posting here. Welcome to the forum.

Woud love to read more about you

Greets from Barcelona
CheerfullyInsane
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Re: Teasing to the edge, but denying orgasm

Post by CheerfullyInsane »

Interesting notion. *LOL*
And welcome! :hi:

The described scenario wouldn't work on me personally, since vibrators leave me utterly cold. No idea why, but no matter how or where they're used my dick seems to scoff sardonically at them. :mrgreen:
Though I can see it used in conjecture with the SB Blowjob Trainer (we really need an acronym for that one...).
Imagine the web-cam aimed at your dick instead of a dildo, and then using a FLeshLight or the like for x number of strokes before getting free.
*Now* imagine getting zapped every time you get near the edge...... :twisted:

As for whether one can cum without contracting the pelvic muscles, that's an unequivocal yes and no.
You can't *orgasm* without contracting the muscles, since those muscles are used to squeeze your prostate gland.
You can, however, drain the cum without orgasm with a little training, AKA 'milking'.
Simply put, when you feel the muscles contract you push as hard as you can, making the muscles incapable of contracting fully. This gives just enough pressure to let the cum leak out without triggering an orgasm as such. Do this 2-3 times and you'll have drained the cum without giving the sub (or yourself) the pleasure of an orgasm.
If you're feeling really evil, you can then allow the orgasm.......
But since the pleasure derived from the male orgasm is mainly derived from the fluids being pumped through the system, an orgasm with a drained gland is an utterly pleasureless and frustrating thing.
(If anyone should be wondering, I'm a wee bit into T&D :mrgreen: )

I'm sure the above device could be programmed to do just that, it just depends on how well one can fine-tune it since the line between orgasm and draining is razor-thin.
Not sure I'd be interested in it though, since I prefer doing the teasing myself. Sort of playing both sides in my head, if you will.
I'm pretty sure there'll be general interest though, just not by me. To each his own. :)

Now, a shop with SB gizmos....*That* I would love to see!
If for no other reason than the existing ones gives a whole new meaning to the term price-gouging.
I'm not sure the customer-base is large enough for a shop with *only* SB items, there are after all limits to how many items each person is liable to buy, and let's face it SB is something of a niche.
But any shop offering SB play-things, even just a handful, would certainly get looked at by me......Well, leered at is perhaps more accurate. :D
enigma42
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Re: Teasing to the edge, but denying orgasm

Post by enigma42 »

That is some very impressive work. I have recently started working with my Ardino board with a vib motor strapped to my CB-6000 cage. The end result being constantly aroused, but robbed of a full erection (and with it orgasm). This led me to start thinking how I could do just what you've done. How I could have my Ardine sense my state of arousal and act accordingly.

If you would start distributing your hardware and software, I would be more then a little interested.
password
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Re: Teasing to the edge, but denying orgasm

Post by password »

That final device you have created.. It seems like some sort of electronic holy grail.

If you can provide instructions on how to create such a device, I would forever be in your debt.
markwb83
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Re: Teasing to the edge, but denying orgasm

Post by markwb83 »

password wrote:That final device you have created.. It seems like some sort of electronic holy grail.
If you can provide instructions on how to create such a device, I would forever be in your debt.
Same here, is there any way you can give us some more details about the hardware and software you were using for this? This would be a perfect base for some nice scenarios.
jemm
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Re: Teasing to the edge, but denying orgasm

Post by jemm »

I'll beta test anything like that! Sounds brilliant.
PiJoy
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Re: Teasing to the edge, but denying orgasm (long, with link

Post by PiJoy »

@bondagepony (and others reading),

First off, congrats for a fine piece of work and an excellent post describing what you did and why.
Making/using a "pre-orgasm sensor" and using it to help create long, intense edging sessions is something I've been interested in for some time. I built a sensor that did a similar thing, in a different way. (details later), and used it as part of a teasing/edging system. I may cross-post this to the DIY forum, since I think it's at least as much about hardware (sensors, etc.) as software
FYI, the device you built is essentially a photo- plethysmograph. These are often part of a pulse oxymeter. Pulse oxymeters are used in medicine and medical research, often placed on either a finger or an ear lobe. So, for those interested in finding more info, you now have a couple more search terms to use. Note also that a photo-based device may pick up more heartbeat than you might think, and that complicates extracting the desired signal out of all the noise and other artifacts.
FYI, there's even a US patent on a sensor that measures a similar muscle contraction of the anal sphyncter:
"Anal Orgasm monitor"
US_Patent_number: 5,787,892
See URL:

http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Pars ... PN/5787892

The patent describes a fluid-filled sensor, that measures muscle contraction via changes in fluid pressure.
That patent apparently has not prevented several companies from designing and selling similar sensors, both for anal and vaginal use; perhaps the key is that these measure the effect of doing the "Kegel excercise," see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kegel_exercise
Such sensors are available through various online retailers, such as:

http://www.pathways-womens-sexual-healt ... evice.html
http://www.kegelexercise4sexualhealth.com/products.html
http://www.kegelmasters.com/kegelmaster ... 5QodLXoJzg
http://www.kegelcompare.com/

Some of which may be usable (or hackable) for use in teasing/edging both males and females.

----

The following is a high-level description of my similar sensor and edging system, used for similar play:
I was concerned about leakage and mess in the patented approach, so I based my sensor on a thin, flexible pressure sensor, the FSR-402 (manufactured by http://www.interlinkelec.com/ but only available from re-sellers, unless you want to buy hundreds or more. IMHO, Interlink is extremely (and I suspect deliberately) non hobbiest/inventor friendly. However, these sensors are available from a number of resellers, including

http://www.imagesco.com/sensors/force-sensors.html
http://www.sparkfun.com/products/9375

I built mine into the narrow part of a DIY anal plug. These sensors have a non-linear response, roughly resistance inversely proportional to pressure. Some detail on circuits to use with FSRs can be fount at:

http://www.trossenrobotics.com/productd ... _Guide.pdf

I note that there are a number of other types of sensors that could be used for detecting muscle tightening, some of which are listed at the imagesco website, but by no means all.
I found that a high-pass filter did a good job of removing session-to-session bias variations and slow drifts that seem unrelated to pre-orgasm-sensing. Stripping off the DC/very low freq variations permitted me to amplify the resulting signal significantly, which was very helpful. Since I also had a vibrator built into the plug, I found it neccessary to also fiter out the high frequency variations (from the vibe.) The combination of high-pass, gain and low-pass was the equivalent of a bandpass filter plus lots of gain, leading to a sensor sensitive to the frequency band most of interest. My data flow was essentially this:

FSR_sensor => Linearizing Circuit => High-pass filter => Amplifier => Low-pass filter =>

A2D_ converter=> microprocessor => detection_algorithm =>

adjustable threshhold /timeout/hysteresis => vibrator-control

My detection algorithm first scored each detected squeeze, and time-tagged them into a buffer. The second part of the algorithm weighted the squeeze history buffer, using time as the main weighting factor. This signal processing resulted in a "close-to-orgasm" signal." I applied an adjustable threshhold to that signal, along with a (programmable) timeout. The resulting system let my vibrators run when the pre-orgasm signal was below the current threshhold. When the threshhold was exceeded, a timer was engaged, and the vibrators were turned off for just enough time for the subject's closeness to orgasm to decrease. Similarly, the algorithm wouldn't re-engage the vibrators until the signal had dropped to some (again programmable) level. The result was quite similar to what bondagepony described -- nice long sessions of being highly aroused, but unable to cum.
Since I enjoy the eventual orgasm, I added a "finale" mode to my system, triggered by a button. This caused my controller to "roll the dice" to determine how many more near-orgasms to put me through, before it turned on all the vibrators full-blast, to make me cum. However, I gave it a significant range to choose from. What I liked about this was that, once I pushed the finale button, I knew that any edge/near orgasm *might* finally be the big O I wanted so badly, however, I never knew what random number my controller selected, until I was cumming!
I lost (or misplaced) some of the electronics for my system in a recent move. However, I hope to rebuild it, and hopefully improve upon it. Probably using an Arduino or similar board as a replacement controller. I'm thinking of moving my sensor to the base of the cock, as the OP has done, that should help decrease high-frequency noise from the vibrators.
I hope you've found the above (admittedly long) post of interest. Feel free to comment here and/or reply via private message. However, please note that sometimes, I'm on this site only sporadically.
Lance_Lake
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Re: Teasing to the edge, but denying orgasm

Post by Lance_Lake »

If either the OP or the last poster wants to build me one, I'd be happy to pay for it. :) Please contact me if interested. :)
jemm
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Re: Teasing to the edge, but denying orgasm

Post by jemm »

Lance_Lake wrote:If either the OP or the last poster wants to build me one, I'd be happy to pay for it. :) Please contact me if interested. :)
Yes, that. Me too. I'm always up for rewarding effort. :)
markwb83
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Re: Teasing to the edge, but denying orgasm

Post by markwb83 »

Hi PiJoy,

Thanks for the information!

I've just ordered some electronics and a processorboard to test with, keep you all updated.

Maybe not really for this thread, but which kind of stimmulation do you guys use to (nearly :twisted:) orgasm?

Aiai, think about this... You're helpless bound with this nearly-cum device attached. The system will only allow you to cum and get released only (with a certain timelimit of course) when...

...you solved an sudoku within x minutes. If you fail, another sudoku is loaded and the game starts over. Even try to concentrate when you're that horny...
...you've watched a complete exciting movie
...you did x DT-blowjobs with Qwerty's blowjobtrainer
...you managed to haven't moved at all for x minutes with Qwerty's Motion Detector
...someone remotely allows you...

Can't wait to test this ;)
Mitciv
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Re: Teasing to the edge, but denying orgasm

Post by Mitciv »

Just thought I would mention that I've also been using a motor taped just under my penis head for years. By the way, game controllers also have two motors in each one, and they work just as well for the purposes states above or for replacing the motor in a broken vibrator, etc. I used to play a lot of games, so I've got loads of broken PS2 controllers which I salvage motors from.

I've also been hooking mine up to an arduino and writing programs to tease or deny orgasm. I've never been able to develop a way to do it 100% successfully, but I basically just use timers (on for 15 seconds, off for 30 seconds) or something like that.

Also I think people are misunderstanding how you use the vibrator motor. The idea is not to use it as a vibrator, but rather to move the skin on your penis. You roll up a piece of tape and secure the motor to that extremely sensitive skin on the bottom of your penis just under the tip. (I'm not sure how it would work for uncircumcised.) Then use a few extra piece to secure the motor on the sides. It's not vibrating in the traditional sense, but rather rapidly pulling the skin from side to side.
PiJoy
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Re: Teasing to the edge, but denying orgasm

Post by PiJoy »

@ Mitciv and others interested,

For me, even small vibes can get me off, if they're in just the right places. I made a toy that used multiple pager motor/vibrators. Two of these were attached to a thin, stainless steel strip, bent into the shape of the letter C. This "C clamp" went around my cock, just below the head, with the gap toward the front, most sensitive area, leaving it open for additional self teasing. I found that having the pager motors switch on and off randomly was actually a better tease than if they were on all the time. I think it's time for me to re-create that toy, with improvements.
cooper1337
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Re: Teasing to the edge, but denying orgasm

Post by cooper1337 »

Hi,
this idea is great (I already tried to think of a sensor for this, but I haven't had any good ideas).
bondagepony, can you post more information on how you processed the signal? I definitely want to build one of these (but not with arduino I guess), but I haven't found any information on the web about what ratings the parts (especially the opto-parts) should have.
Definitely a very good idea, more of them!
Felix_99fd
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Re: Teasing to the edge, but denying orgasm

Post by Felix_99fd »

Hello,

I've worked on something similar, too. My approach was to monitor the heart rate to detect when the user gets close to orgasm. But I found out that this input is not as good as I thought (detection using an ear lobe sensor was perfectly, but the signal didn't carry the information I needed). My conclusion was to try something that monitors the muscle tension. Last week I have seen an article in a German computer magazine that pointed me to Adafruit Industries, a company that sells conductive rubber stretch sensors for 10 US-$/meter. This maybe could be used to detect variations in the diameter of the penis. But on the other hand the mechanism described in the first posting of this thread has even more appeal to me. I think I will try this out.

My goal is to provide a small standalone box where you just need to plug the vibrator and the sensor(s) in. The current prototype for a vibe control unit has approx. the size of a pack of cigarettes (10 x 7 x 3 cm) and will be able to control one vibrator egg using pulse width modulation (PWM). It will have an interface to the PC to program the device and optionally for controlling the vibrator "on-line" by a PC program (maybe even over the Internet). For the next device I'm going to try out the sensors described in this thread.

Greetings from Germany,
Felix
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